Online Blog

Hi, Judy. I agree with what you're saying here.
It seems like I've seen some other very interesting conversation on
another board that you're involved in about the risks of taking
iodine if you have Hashi's. I have tried to follow these
conversations, although I have to admit when you all start with the
in-depth biochemistry stuff, I get a bit lost.
I'm ordering an iodine loading test just to see what my results
are. I have Hashi's. No elevated TPO antibodies, just anti-
thyroglobulin antibodies.
What do you feel the risks of taking iodine supplements in someone
with Hashi's are? Not trying to start another war, just genuinely
curious. I'm reading all this new information on iodine with
interest and am trying to decide if it's for me. Thanks for all
your research and for sharing.
Amy

Gastric by-pass? OH NO!!!!! Pain? What? Oh my goodness, um I think
there's something I might be able to help you with.
I read where you had RAI so are now likely thyroidless as I am.
What meds are you on and dosages? Are you still experiencing hypO
symptoms? Have you had an Iodine Loading test?
Let me tell you a little about me. At age 21 my tube typing operation
ended up being the hysterectomy my hospital room mate was supposed to
have. In 1990 my "healthy" thyroid was destroyed by RAI. I won't go
into why, but let's just say I should have sued the doc and tossed
him in prison before I fell into the swirling pit of h*ll I ended up
in.
I went from a 95lb athlete (I'm 4ft 11) to an "obese", bald,
crippled, OLD hag. I actually gained 60-70lbs in the 2 months after
the RAI and on synthroid ($ynthCRAP), and piled on more after that. I
suffered in extreme agony for over a decade and when I was diagnosed
with systemic organ failure ("all" of my organs were in the process
of shutting down), the terror brought me to the internet to find out

Antoinette, have you had your doctor's appointment yet? Do you have
your thoughts and questions written out?
Let us know how it goes. I really hope he listens to you this
time. Remember, he works for you, not the other way around. Look
him in the eye and tell him that it is completely unacceptable for
you to feel the way you do on a daily basis and that you will not
accept anything less than a full consultation to find out what's
going on. It is NOT in your head.
Good luck!
Amy

An additional tip for those that read the group posts using their own
email and not from the group page, and want to start a new post.
Open up your compose mail window, whichever way your email works.... in
the SEND TO box enter the Group's email address:

Hi Yall,
I hope this email find you all well. September is Thyroid Cancer
Awareness month. As you all know I am a survivor of Papillary Thyroid
Cancer. I feel very Blessed and want to share all of this information
with you all.
PLEASE read thru the website and have your NECK CHECKED!!!!!
http://www.thyca.org/
Thru the month of September I'll be sending out various emails with
Thyroid Cancer info on it. This is in support of Thyroid Cancer Awareness.
Have a Blessed Month!!!
:)
**Huggles**
Melissa

Hi again Lucy. Good to see you back here again. I'm sorry to hear your back is
hurting. I'm sure that doesn't make the whole fitness thing very easy.
You know, you bring up a good point about going by the body and clinical
symptoms. I've read thyroid books that talk about what treatment was like
before the TSH test was invented. From what I've read, hypo was diagnosed by
certain clinical symptoms and a physical examination. Treatment was also based
on how the patient was feeling.
It seems like the TSH test revolutionized the way thyroid disorders were
treated, and I'm not sure for the better. I know that I was not diagnosed when
I had very, very obvious clinical symptoms of hypo. My TSH was 4.9, and the lab
ranges said that anything beloe 5.5 was normal, not the 3.5 we see now. I often
think about those 2 lost years and how different they would have been if my
doctor had listened to my symptoms and not looked at the number.
Why can't we get doctors to be reasonable with balancing the numbers vs what the
patient says? I highly doubt people go into doctor's offices seeking thyroid
meds like narcotics or something. I don't know about you, but I got so sick of
being made to feel like a hypochondriac and that it was all in my head.
BTW, have any of the rest of you heard that the TSH test was invented by the
same company who makes Synthroid? I heard that somewhere, but can't remember
where.
Amy

I looked at one of the iodine websites Sam posted earlier, and I ordered my test
kit.
Although someone on another board said her doctor told her today that no one in
America today has to worry about iodine deficiency. What do you all think of
that? That's what I always read, too. But I live in the Ohio River Valley, and
that's supposed to be one of the iodine deficient places.
Marie, I hope you feel better with your dose change. It is so frustrating to
play this adjusting game with your doses all the time. I'm still trying to get
mine right, too.
Amy

Your morning is about 3/4 up in the range, but what's the evening
level? It should be low. If it's high, that points to adrenal
fatigue. However, I think the 24hr urine test is a little more
accurate, but more importantly how did you do when you tried some of
the self tests? The ones at:
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Despite what blood or wrine tests show, if you are experiencing the
symptoms of adrenal fatigue, you have adrenal fatigue.
You might be familiar with thyroid tests showing one is "within
normal range" but the body is still a walking pulsating glob of
hypOthyroid symptoms. Despite the fact that the test results
said "normal", the symptoms scream hyOthyroidism. Listen to the
symptoms...that's the body's way of telling us what it needs.
Sam
(thyroid-less, Iodized, and Armour-ized)
k9gang@...
http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-09/IOD_09.htm
http://www.iodine4health.com
http://www.quackcenter.com/ideficiency.html
http://www.helpmythyroid.com/iodine.htm
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

Hi Sam - I think you were responding to me. Iodine testing IS something
my doctor and I are discussing. She is wanting to wait until I am off
these birth control pills. And, I think she is convinced I am going to
feel better with the dosage change too. We'll see. BTW, I did the self
test, and it did not disappear in one hour, and it was gone after 4 or 5
hours. I realize the urine test is the scientifc method, and that is what
I will pursue doing.
Marie

Hi, Marie, thanks so much for sharing your situation. Your warning is helpful.
That 122 pulse would worry me, too. I'm curious, did you take your Armour on
the day of your test? The reason I'm asking is that I had a very unexpected
blood draw a few weeks ago, and my free T3 came in over range, too. I posted
that on another thyroid board, and was told by several people that if I'd taken
Armour the day of the testing, I wouldn't have accurate results. They said that
it would indicate a false high.
I'm not saying that's what happened to you, I'm just curious and wanting to
compare. I cut my dose down, too, due to the FT3 level and even considered
replacing some Armour with T4 only, but I am starting to have hypo symptoms
again. It's such a balancing act, isn't it?
Amy

...that may be viewed as bringing up the recent past upheaval
regarding posts by ChristianGirlTex.
In temporarily taking some control of the group, I did say that I
would not be approving these types of posts.
It may feel unfair, and I am not completely comfortable with going
against my plan, but I am going to approve ThyroidLucy's post. If
you would like to avoid the continued conversation, I invite you to
use your delete key.
In deciding to approve Lucy's message, I rationalized it this way:
1.) Lucy is a long time member of ThyroidFitness and supporter of
Bee.
2.) Lucy has had her own thyroid support group over on MSN for a
while and I have complete confidence that Lucy's intentions about
thyroid topics are honorable. It is my belief that Lucy is NOT out
to create more drama or that her comments should be construed as
bashing/flaming anyone.
3.) A while back Lucy had been directly in the conversation, as you
will see from her reply. I feel she has the right to defend her
position and have her questions answered. And as you will see from
Lucy's e-mail, she has good questions to ask CGT, and I for one am
interested in the response.
4.) Lucy is a trusted Moderator of the group and I don't like
stepping on her toes. It is overstepping my boundary by telling
another Mod she can't state her opinion.
Please don't interpret #4 as though I enjoy overstepping the toes of
all other group members here at ThyroidFitness. I don't enjoy it in
the least.
If anyone has a problem with my reasoning, I invite you to e-mail me
personally to discuss it further.
~ SociableLinda/Pooshabi
Moderator

he is testing my free t3 and free t4 this time after much much pleading I am
on the thyroxine meds. and they stink.
~~~~~
Antoinette,
I don't know when your appointment is, but my doctor tells me not to take my
meds for 12+ hour prior to testing. If it is a morning appointment, I take
my meds after the draw. I try to avoid afternoon appointments, because I
want my meds that day! Although, I have taken them for the first time in a day
after my afternoon blood draw, I just don't like to do that. I *do* like to
keep it consistent though, by always getting labs done before 11 AM. (Well,
thyroid labs! others don't really matter...unless it is a fasting blood sugar
or something.)
Keep us posted on what happens!
HTH,
Laura

Amy,
It is wonderful that you are getting well. I have gotten well. Many have
gotten well, many are still on that downward spiral of not getting well, but
sicker. How sad. I pray for their gained health, as many here have gained.
Please, continue to pay it forward, that is how the world goes 'round.
One of the things that seems to come with proper adrenal function, *is*
being able to 'throw it off/have thick skin.' You are doing great. How is
that
saying? "It all started with a series of unfortunate events." and can change
when we pay it forward.
Keep plugging away. We all make mistakes, that is how we learn. Please,
keep that confidence you do have and build upon it.
Have a wonderful, blessed day!
Laura
~~~~
Plus, that original post was my first attempt to share the information I've
learned at NTH. I feel that if people help you, you should give back by
helping others. That post was my first attempt to give knowledge back and
help.
I have to tell you, given how well it was received and the ensuing
controvery it has generated, I doubt very, very, very seriously if I will feel
confident about trying to share information like this again.

My first thoughts on this:
Adrenal support is needed. Self test those at:
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
It's never wise to take Armour thyroid the day of blood tests, or 24-
36hrs prior. One wants to test what's in the blood, not the meds one
has just taken.
Exessive bleeding would indicate low progesterone - low protesterone
will affect the adrenals which will in turn affect the thyroid.
150mg Armour is not a high dose. I'm on 11 grains (660mg) and my
heart rate is my normal 88-96, normal blood pressure, etc, however I
am also taking adrenal support because my adrenals are too friend to
produce enough cortesol to open my T3 receptors. But that's just me.
However, in every human body enough cortesol is required to open T3
receptors. Without enough, those thyroid hormoens one has just taken
will remain in the blood causing all sorts of problems like excessive
heart rate and hypEr symptoms, to name two among a few more.
Just my thoughts
Sam
(thyroid-less, Iodized, and Armour-ized)
k9gang@...
http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-09/IOD_09.htm
http://www.iodine4health.com
http://www.quackcenter.com/ideficiency.html
http://www.helpmythyroid.com/iodine.htm
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

Hi Sam - My morning cortisol(fasting, btw) in June was 16 (range 2-25).
What is your opinion? This was a blood cortisol result. Thanks.
Marie

Try this one: http://www.breastcancerchoices.org/loading.html
Even the one at http://www.vrp.com you can get without a doc, but you
have to email them first and they will provide someone to interpret
the results.
Sam
(thyroid-less, Iodized, and Armour-ized)
k9gang@...
http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-09/IOD_09.htm
http://www.iodine4health.com
http://www.quackcenter.com/ideficiency.html
http://www.helpmythyroid.com/iodine.htm
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

I have approved posts that went back to Friday. All posts prior to my
message of 12:30'ish today were approved.
All posts made from here on, provided they are on thyroid and fitness
topic, will be approved.
Thank you again for your patience during this regrouping time.
~ SociableLinda/Pooshabi
Moderator
P.S. My apologies in the delay of your important and on topic posts,
referenced above. Moderators were obviously not available to approve
them before now.

I would like to offer a suggestion that may help eleviate some of
the "oh my God what is coming next" feelings many of us may be
feeling when we see the "Holy Cow", etc Subject Lines when they
arrive in our mailboxes.
Please feel free to change the Subject Line of a post.
In the past, if I was posting to a specific person, I would add
their name to the Subject Line. Sometimes, on message boards, after
4 or 5 posts to an original e-mail, the context has little to do
with the original topic. I have seen Subject Lines that say "Was:
old post name, Now: current discussion topic. Personally, I simply
changed the Subject Line to the current topic name.
While it is nice to have a "thread" of posts that attach to the
original topic, it isn't "necessary" to continue replying over and
over. There is always the freedom to start a brand new post.

no need to forwar this linda, just wanted to say thankyou it has been crazy!!
Antoinette, mommy too---
Nicholas Derrell 8 yrs.11m.
Nathan stewart 4 yrs. 7m.
briana Rose 2 yrs. 1m.

In a message dated 8/30/2006 7:51:07 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, christiangirltex@... writes:

sam, i remember you told me that synthroid was s... 3 weeks ago, I
stopped taking it then afraid I was going bald and afraid it was making
me sicker now i think I am very very hypo

"christiangirltex" your nonsense has spilled into yet another thyroid group that i belong too. Quite frankly I have read enough of your ignorant propaganda and ridiculous statements. Why do you feel so threatened by opinions that differ from your own. No one has asked you to follow any particular advise, they have only stated their own opinions and experiences. I personally have benefited tremendously from Armour and iodine, haven't felt this good in many years. If Synthroid works for you, then that's wonderful for you, but for many other's it just doesn't do the job.

I have joined various thyroid groups to gain knowledge and understanding about this illness and have found a great deal of useful information that I have greatly benefited from. If someone posts information that I don't agree with or that I feel would not be helpful for my own situation, I simply press the delete key and move on to the next post. Perhaps you could try using this feature as well, it would certainly eliminate much of the conflict that you have stirred up recently.In all honesty, If your true intention is to educate and help others your antagonistic behavior and attitude is actually working against you. Perhaps you should rethink your means to deliver your message. One would be much more receptive to listening to what you have to say if you were not so aggressive and insulting.

MzzVicki

-I've done that test too, and mine was gone in 45 minutes, no stain
or anything. I've been taking 2 1/2 mgs. of iodine in the form of
kelp but I have to take 6 of them to get that dose and I really would
like to take 5 mgs. I would be putting down a lot of pills. What kind
of iodine are you talking about? LOL
Debbie

Welcome, members, to Thyroid Fitness. My name is Linda Williams aka
SociableLinda and Pooshabi. I joined this group back when
BeeFuddled912 was on her thyroid quest, which would be back in
2001. I built a trusting online friendship with Bee and she asked
me to become one of the many moderators of this group.
Over the years my overall health has taken many turns and I have not
been active in the group for long periods of time. I receive all
emails. I admit to deleting many of them when my health is in
danger. This is a prime reason why this group has become such a
mess.
Bee has overcome many health problems, had family life changes and
is now well enough to work. I have not seen Bee online for several
weeks and now feel the need to step in and use my authority to reign
in the group. For all I know, her computer could be on the fritz or
she could be seriously ill. What I do know is that she would NOT
want this group to continue in the negative direction it has been on
for a couple of weeks now.
Immediately after this message posts, I am going to turn the group
on to moderated status. Every message will have to be moderated and
I will decide if it is to be posted. All thyroid and fitness
relevant posts, that do not contain personal attacks/shaming
statements/references to the recent flames will be approved. Any
messages referencing the flame topics/shaming statements and
personal attacks will be rejected. Please know that I do not sit at
my computer all day long and am honestly not looking forward to this
task as it is rather time consuming. But I completely believe it is
a necessary step in redirecting the group toward what Bee would
want. I will be reviewing all of the posts and all members who have
recently joined. I will determine who has been flaming, who has
been respecting, who has been overly pushing their own agenda and
who actually has valid information to support this group.
I will be deleting posts that negatively reflect on this group that
Bee worked for years to create.
Bee has overall authority of the direction of this group. I expect
that she will change any overcorrection that I may make. Keep in
mind, I am a very rigid person and frankly, don't feel personal
agenda/attacking bullshit belongs here, and I have seen A LOT of
it. Chances are great that I will overcorrect the group, piss a lot
of members off, and even irratate the hell out of Bee. Throught his
process I pray for the strength to do what Bee would think is right
for her group.
Thank you, in advance, for your cooperation and patience. Those
members who are truly dedicated to Bee's Thyroid Fitness group will
be understanding of this process. Should you desire to remove
yourself from the group, please do so at your own will. You can
unsubscribe from the group by logging in to

Sam, do all the iodine loading sites you've mentioned require a
doctor's order for the test? I've looked at the ones that have been
recommended, but it seems they all say you need a doctor's order.
Thanks,
Amy

Hi Linda - Thanks for the information. My doctor prescribed xenical but I
did not have the script filled, mainly due to the cost which would run about
$200 a month. I am just recently seeing a new doctor and my FreeT3 came in
way over range; 496 (230-420) and when I was in her office yesterday my
pulse was 122. NOT GOOD. I hope I have not done any damage to my heart.
For the first time ever I was having heart palps last week. I was taking
150mg Armour, but she has cut me down to 120mg, and she thinks we may even
go lower. These were all amounts prescribed by my prior doctor(same one
who prescribed xenical). We are adjusting down slowly, plus I have
recently gone on birth control pills for a few months due to continual
bleeding, but that is another issue, and a different doctor,lol. I share
all of this to remind EVERYONE reading that more is not always better.
Overmedicating mimics similar symptoms as undermedicating and can also be
dangerous.
Marie
_____

I am cutting and pasting what I just posted to another response, and then
will add more:
I am just recently seeing a new doctor and my FreeT3 came in way over range;
496 (230-420) and when I was in her office yesterday my pulse was 122. NOT
GOOD. I hope I have not done any damage to my heart. For the first time ever
I was having heart palps last week. I was taking 150mg Armour, but she has
cut me down to 120mg, and she thinks we may even go lower. These were all
amounts prescribed by my prior doctor(same one who prescribed xenical). We
are adjusting down slowly, plus I have recently gone on birth control pills
for a few months due to continual bleeding, but that is another issue, and a
different doctor,lol. I share all of this to remind EVERYONE reading that
more is not always better. Overmedicating mimics similar symptoms as
undermedicating and can also be dangerous.
I want to add to the scenario that from my old doctor I have labs take in
June 19, 2006. He did NOT run my frees and has not for a very long time.
Here is what my NON Free results were:
T3 Uptake 30.6(range 20 - 38.5)
T4 10.8 (range 4.4-12.5)
These results do not indicate an overmedication but my FREE T3 just two
months later DOES. And, I was on the same dosage with both labs. In
fact, my new doctor was hesitant to run the Free's but she did, and she said
she is so glad we did! Get your Free's tested. I am hoping and praying
I have not done any heart damage.
Marie

I sent this through once but it hasn't shown up....
I am cutting and pasting what I just posted to another response, and then
will add more:
I am just recently seeing a new doctor and my FreeT3 came in way over range;
496 (230-420) and when I was in her office yesterday my pulse was 122. NOT
GOOD. I hope I have not done any damage to my heart. For the first time ever
I was having heart palps last week. I was taking 150mg Armour, but she has
cut me down to 120mg, and she thinks we may even go lower. These were all
amounts prescribed by my prior doctor. We are adjusting down slowly, plus I
have recently gone on birth control pills for a few months due to continual
bleeding, but that is another issue, and a different doctor,lol. I share all
of this to remind EVERYONE reading that more is not always better.
Overmedicating mimics similar symptoms as undermedicating and can also be
dangerous.
I want to add to the scenario that from my old doctor I have labs take in
June 19, 2006. He did NOT run my frees and has not for a very long time.
Here is what my NON Free results were:
T3 Uptake 30.6(range 20 - 38.5)
T4 10.8 (range 4.4-12.5)
These results do not indicate an overmedication but my FREE T3 just two
months later DOES. And, I was on the same dosage with both labs. In
fact, my new doctor was hesitant to run the Free's but she did, and she said
she is so glad we did! Get your Free's tested. I am hoping and praying
I have not done any heart damage.
Marie

Hi Marie,
He prescribed Adipex-P, but you have to be real careful with this
stuff because it can cause some serious problems with one's heart. My
doc only allowed me to be on it for about 60 days (actually less than
that), but I had some pills left over from my script as well as 1
refill (which I didn't fill, but should have). I did do a search for
this drug, it is recommended that you use it short term while you are
adjusting your diet, health routine, adding in additional exercise,
etc. He then switched me to Meridia which is easier on the system, but
very costly, I wasn't able to find at a reasonable cost so never
filled the script that he gave me for it, the cheapest I found cost
about $100/month. I don't know about you but I can't afford that, and
I didn't lose as much weight on it as I did on the Adipex-P. The
Adipex is a 37.5 mg tab, I took half of that a day.
Hope this info helps you some.
Linda

Synthroid is a synthetic single hormone T4 drug with an altered
molecule to make it patentable. You can read a list of it's side
effects in the package insert included with each bottle, or your
pharmacist can include the info if requested.
So, christiangirltex, you went OFF sythroid. But did you replace it
with another form of thyroid replacement? If not, WHY????? Yes,
synthcrap has a number of serious side effects, and I experienced them
full blast (and nearly died), but I did not just go off it cold turkey,
I waited until I had an appropriate replacement. In my case that was a
whole thyroid med (Armour).
If you are still suffering, and not able to find an appropriate medical
care professional to give you that which you need, you may be forced to
take matters into your own hands and heal thyself as many thousands of
us have. I suggest 2 websites to read:
http://www.armourthyroid.com (you can find a doc here as well)
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php (read the doctors' comments)
Sam
(thyroid-less, Iodized, and Armour-ized)
k9gang@...
http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-09/IOD_09.htm
http://www.iodine4health.com
http://www.quackcenter.com/ideficiency.html
http://www.helpmythyroid.com/iodine.htm
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

Hi, Antoinette. I hate when a doctor won't give you time to talk
about your needs. That stinks. I have a PCP like that, and I wrote
out all my symptoms and my thoughts ahead of time and gave it to him
at the beginning of my appointment. That way I knew it would be in
writing and in my chart, and I wouldn't have to worry about getting
intimidated or flustered.
There's a test called ACTH stim that would be helpful. It measures if
the pituitary is sending out the hormone that tells the adrenals to
make cortisol. If he does a one time blood cortisol test, it won't
tell you much. He least needs to do a 2 time a day cortisol test to
see how your levels are in the morning and evenings. Four times a day
is better. I would also want my DHEA level tested, as that is
produced by the adrenal glands, and you can have problems when it's
low.
That's just my initial thoughts. Hopefully someone else will chime in
with good info. If Sam is still around, she will have some good
ideas. If not, feel free to join the Thyroid board or the Natural
Thyroid Hormone board and post your questions there. You will get
lots of good information there.
Best wishes,
Amy

I have anther dr. apt. coming soon and have been trying to get my thought together on my condition so I can feel up the 2 & 1/2 min. he gives me before he cuts me off and leaves. so I think I have adrennall fatuege (sp.) and he is testing my free t3 and free t4 this time after much much pleading I am on the thyroxine meds. and they stink.
Antoinette, mommy too---
Nicholas Derrell 8 yrs.11m.
Nathan stewart 4 yrs. 7m.
briana Rose 2 yrs. 1m.

Hi Linda - It's nice to meet you. Congratulations on your weight loss. I know it's not an easy road. Fatigue is my biggest issue and I am curious as to what weight loss drug your doctor prescribed that also helped with fatigue.

Thank you in advance for your help.

Marie

WELL, who can come up with a new name for this group???

Bashing R Us???? Texas's girls Bash???? Who is the moderator of this group????

How about "We don't want to grow Up??? "School yard Antics"

I am leaving this group - I came on my own, I will leave on my own.........I didn't know anything about all this stuff until I got here.......

The latest comments by this Christian texas girl just go beyond reasoning........

I too wrote her off list, offering her help, understanding on both side, NO Reply - but after seeing what she did to Laura who apparently wrote her off list - and then she publishes the letter..........well that just has to be about the LOWEST OF LOWS.

I won't make a comment as to your "Christianity" but I CERTAINLY WILL about your absolute plain lack of manners!!! My god!!! Where is your mother and what did she or not teach you, or have you just forgotten????

You now go down in the category of a big, loud, rude, ill-mannered, out spoken, crude person, who I think DOES need a doctor, but NOT a medical one.

YOU.... Ms Texas have a problem - a REALLY BIG problem!!!! And until YOU are gone, well there just isn't much hope of this group existing.........you, alone, have managed to TAKE DOWN this group.

This group was small to begin with, smaller now, and who new would want to join and see all this crap???

SO - just name this group "ChristianTexasGirl" group of One!!!!

--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/428 - Release Date: 8/25/2006

a drug can not cure sleep apnea, I promise.
There are two types of sleep apnea
obstructive sleep apnea: caused by your body type (overweight, large
tongue, short neck etc.)
or
brain/central sleep apnea (forget to breath at night)
from the Armour you could start to lose weight and from the weight
loss you are no longer "obstructive" therfore can breath at night!
sam do a little more research!!

sam, i remember you told me that synthroid was s... 3 weeks ago, I
stopped taking it then afraid I was going bald and afraid it was making
me sicker now i think I am very very hypo

Sleep apnea? Well, I can certainly contribute on that one.
I know a number of folks who's sleep apnea completely stopped after
they went on Armour Thyroid. Apparently it's another one of those
pesky thyroid related problems. NO surgery no c-pap machine, just the
right meds.
It stands to reason since the thyroid regulates the entire metabolism.
If the thyroid is ill, the metabolism will suffer and crash.
Check this one out...insulin resistence, which leads to type II
diabetes, which leads to type I diabetes (pancreas failure), is
caused by an ill thyroid. EEK!
I was dating this one guy (after him another, but the story sit he
same), who had Type II diabetes. So I tell him about thyroid and iodine
deficiency (diabetes is a "symptoms" of iodine deficiency also). And
then he goes and gets on the right meds and reversed the Type II
Diabetes, gets his helth and gorgeous body back and decides to date
other chicks. ARGH! Guy number 2 did the same thing, but guy number 2
also had sleep apnea, but it went away on Armour.
Men...I swear... <wink
Sam
(54yr old thyroid-less, Iodized, and Armour-ized granny)
k9gang@...
http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-09/IOD_09.htm
http://www.iodine4health.com
http://www.quackcenter.com/ideficiency.html
http://www.helpmythyroid.com/iodine.htm
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

Hi, I'm new to the list.
I just heard about this group and thought I'd pop over to see how it
was here.
Here's a little history.
In 1990 I went to a doc to fix my back, which I had broken in an
questrian accident. So he destroyed my thyroid and put me on synthroid.
I had been a 95 pound muscular athlete, but after the RAI I became
obese, bald, and severely crippled. In 2003 I learned about Armour
thyroid, adrenal support, and BHRT. It's 2006 and I am no longer obese,
bald, crippled, or unhealthy.
I am a 54yr old granny on a motorcycle. :)
Sam
NW Washington State
k9gang@...

Zie: www.cak-bz.nl
Hier kan je de eigen bijdrage voor 2004 berekenen.
Nieuwe tarieven, nieuwe berekening.
Vanaf 2004 zal de eigenbijdrageregeling thuiszorg wijzigen. In dit bericht
geven wij een toelichting op de wijzigingen die voor u van belang kunnen zijn.
De minister van Volksgezondheid, Welzijn en Sport (VWS) heeft besloten om de
eigen bijdrage thuiszorg te verhogen van ? 4,60 (uurtarief 2003) naar ? 11,80
per uur. Dit betreft zorg die verleend wordt vanaf periode 1 van het zorgjaar
2004. Het bedrag dat verschuldigd is, blijft afhankelijk van uw inkomen.
De eigen bijdrage zal op een andere wijze worden berekend. Een vast percentage
van uw gezamenlijk verzamelinkomen (15%) wordt verlaagd met een vast bedrag
omdat u zelf de kosten voor levensonderhoud moet voldoen. Op uw factuur worden
de zorguren per week weergegeven. De eigen bijdrage thuiszorg wordt met ingang
van periode 1 van 2004 niet meer per week berekend, maar per periode (veelal
vier weken). Het minimum dat u verschuldigd bent, is ? 16,- per periode.
Afhankelijk van de hoogte van het (gezamenlijk) verzamelinkomen is deze
maximale periodebijdrage hoger.
Op de nieuwe beschikking die u ontvangt nadat uw definitieve (inkomens)gegevens
bekend zijn, wordt de maximale periodebijdrage vermeld die in uw situatie van
toepassing is. Graag hadden wij al voor u uitgerekend welke bijdrage u over
2004 verschuldigd zou zijn. Helaas is dit niet mogelijk omdat wij eerst in de
loop van 2004 over uw definitieve inkomensgegevens beschikken. Op de pagina
Bereken uw eigen bijdrage is een rekenmodel opgenomen waar het mogelijk is om
op basis van door u opgegeven gegevens uw maximale periodebijdrage uit te
rekenen.
Zowel het CAK-BZ als de zorgaanbieders hebben geen invloed op de hoogte van de
tarieven of andere wijzigingen in wet- en regelgeving. Dit wordt vastgesteld
door het ministerie van VWS, het CAK-BZ voert de regeling uit. Als u een klacht
wenst in te dienen tegen de nieuwe regeling, kunt u zich wenden tot het College
voor zorgverzekeringen, Postbus 320, 1110 AH te Diemen.

Hi, my name is Debbie and I'm hypo. I use to have a good work out
routine. Until the hypo set in. I'm finally feeling good again and
want to get back to it. I think because its been so long I don't know
if I'll actully have the energy I used to.So I will probobly just
listen at first. Debbie

Kellie, yes, I absolutely have the same problem. Have you ever done the Firm
workouts? I used to do those and be really good at them. Now I have trouble
doing even mild exercise. Some of the people on a couple of my other groups say
that adrenal fatigue can cause endurance problems. They also say that trying
to do a lot of vigorous exercise isn't good when you're trying to rest and heal
your adrenals. But I'm like you and I want my endurance and fitness back right
away.
Congrats on the weight loss! That's awesome. Be careful though that you don't
drop your calories too low and make your body think you're starving. Then it
will hold on to all it's fat for dear life.
Amy

To all:
I had no intentions of stirring everyone into this frenzy when I
started this thread. I am not on here daily and was quite surprised
at the flames rising above my computer!
I simply wanted to hear about other people's experiences and opinions.
I do not make medical decisions solely on the advice or experiences
of one person or only one Doctor or medical professional.
I saw my Dr. last week and she doesn't want to make any changes until
we hear from the Endocrinologist. I had blood tests on the 10th and
havent heard back from the Endo. yet.
The initial blood tests ruled out adrenal problems.
I believe the Endo. said he wanted to essentially "temporarily
replace" my thyroid with medication to see what the results would be.
Don't quote me on that. I have been trying for 2 weeks to reach the
Endo. or his nurse and they have not returned my calls. Thursday is
my last day of the 137microgram Levoxyl pills. If he does not
respond by then (I will try calling again tomorrow)I will inform my
Dr. and drop down to the 100 micrograms pills of synthroid that I
currently have.
I am being scheduled for a sleep apnia test. I was surprised to hear
(from my Dr.) that sleep apnia tratment can help other problems. It
is good to hear that some people on this list have had good results.
The only way to learn is to ask questions.
Sherry F.

I really would like to about fitness, anyone else? Me I am using a
treadmill, I also walk, and drink lots of water. I am having a hard
time with endurance. Does anyone else have that problem? And, what do
you do to help? I have lost 7 pounds so far and want to lose more. I
am also keeping my cals under 1200 (for a full day), fat grams under
30, and lots of fiber to make me feel full. KEllI

I'm trying to figure out what is wrong with some of you. I don't understand all the attacking going on. I came on this list because I am on several thyroid lists. One is where I get most of my information on taking armour and addressing adrenal fatigue. Another one is getting info on natural thyroid and hormonal medication and the name of this list is suppose to be thyroid fitness where I hoped to get info on well geez, thyroid fitness. I have gained so much weight since I have been diagnosed hypo and thought I might find some help here. Yes, I too hope to be able to pass on what I have found to help me, just like I always look to find out what works for others. It's called SHARING. I know some of you think doctors are gods but I have yet to come across a doctor that knows anything helpful in dealing with hypothyroidism. So when I call doctors idiots, that has been my experience with doctors. Believe me, I would be thrilled to find a good doctor, I'm still searching. This is
my experience, like it or not or believe me or not. I refuse to stay sick any longer and it just kills me to see people wrongly treated by doctors. If I hadn't been open and done lots of research, I'd still be sick and not able to function.

I would never ever defend someone who bashed christianity and would be the first person to call them on it. I do not believe any comments made were bashing christianity, just the actions. As a christian myself, I know the first time you state you're a christian, you are looked at differently and held to a higher standard. Yes, we are human and make mistakes but calling me a liar and someone else the "B" word, wasn't very nice. She issued an apology but wouldn't let it go so doesn't seem like it was sincere. I think it's dispicable to be attacking when people are here to learn and help.

You know, as it gets stated alot, one size doesn't fit all and what if anothers experience was what led you to better health. Is that not a good thing? I have read that there are alot of sick people here, why is it that your way is the only way? Doctors do not know everything so why shouldn't we search for something better? If you all want to move on, why keep bringing this all up.

Vicki

Ya'll if ANY of you need to discuss this further, please take it off line or perhaps find another group that might suit your needs better.

The rest of us have had enough.

Laura, I wasn't bashing the Christian name. Talking about one
person isn't bashing the entire Christian religion. You took mine
and Sue's statements COMPLETELY out of context.
And yes, I do think it's ironic to have the word "Christian" in a
user name, then call someone a "TRUE BITCH" on an internet forum.
And to say "blea, blea, blea" when someone is pouring their heart
out about losing their mother.
I'm going to have to think long and hard before responding to the
rest of this.

Amy, I think it is time you admitted to recruiting help from another group. Sue, I think you should admit to coming here to "have some fun" and to educate a few people. You came here specifically to defend Amy. You were not looking for advice, you were here to give it. There are others of you here that also came at the plea from Amy (Vicki, "Oh great. I'm on here to find help and you're accusing me of lying. Wow, real nice person you are.") and others. I think it is only fair that you admit that that is why you are here as new members.

I am not in disagreement with what you all are saying about Armour, adrenals, ferritin or much of the medical field, however, those of you that just joined (via plea) DID have an ulterior motive. The motive to help others is not a bad thing, but the stealth is.

I *know* this group has been quiet for a long time (I have been a member for about a year and a half)...there *are* other groups out there, that are active. The flavors of each group are all different. Let's not make this a mini - me situation, please. Doctor's kept me sick for a very long time, but I do my best not to generalize the doctor bashing. Referring to a specific situation, rather than a whole segment of the profession is more reasonable. Sue, I think your sarcasm can be difficult to process for some, as the antagonism and underlying anger you have toward the medical community comes out loud and clear. I am not saying I don't understand where you are coming from, I most certainly do!

Amy and Sue, it saddens me to see you bashing the Christian name ...and it making you 'nauseous'. And why is it irony? Christians aren't perfect...and don't claim to be. They are followers of Christ only, so obviously cannot be perfect! We *all* make mistakes, followers of Christ or not. On Armour or not. No, not one of us is perfect. Yet we are all capable of forgiveness and moving on. Let's move on, as suggested previously and let by gones be by gones.

Make it a great day everyone!

Laura

I'm sure that if and when I get his books, I'll be saying "Aha,
that's so me!" I haven't gotten any of Dr Brownstein's books yet but
everyone who has, seems to love them and they say that everything he
states in his books, really hits home with them. You're talking about
Spephanie who sees Dr. Brownstein? She loves that guy. I would, too
but he is just too far for me to go to him. I am supposed to make an
appt with my dr since he adjusted my armour dose over the phone so I
plan on asking him to check my iodine levels. And for that info, I

Hi Marie,
Here's some info that I got from Sam. Happy reading!
http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD- 09/IOD_09. htm
http://www.iodine4health.com
http://www.helpmythyroid.com/iodine.htm
http://www.quackcenter.com/iodoral.html
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/dt.php
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

Mari - I don't know much about the actual iodine test. I did the same thing as
you - I painted a two inch but I put it on my stomach area. Lots of people I've
heard also but it on the breast area. The sooner it fades apparently the more
deficient you are. There are also some people who don't think this works
because it can just rub off but since my ND has me taking it I tend to think
that we (the general public) could use it. Since there is so much fluoride and
chlorine around and they displace iodine molecules it only makes sense to me
that we could use more of it.
I've heard that dr. brownsteins book is really good. Sue - what did you find
out after you read it? Were there any aha! moments as you went through it?
There is someone on one of my other thyroid groups who sees dr. brownstein and
she loves him. He has her on the iodoral pills and she feels great. There was
some discussion though on whether someone with graves or hashi's should be
taking it. I guess I'll have to buy the book.
Sorry I can't help you more.
Terry

Hi Marie,
Organic iodine is a pure form of iodine. I'm not sure how they make
it. The Loading Test is where you take 50 mgs of Iodoral and then you
bring the 24 hr urine sample in to see how much iodine is in the
sample. I think you retest in 3-6 months, and if you're urine sample
has 90% iodine in it, you just go to a maintance dose of 1.25 mg (2
drops of Lugols or the Iodoral tabs daily. You take 4 of the Iodoral
tabs and your dr should be able to tell you what dose you can lower
it to once you're optimized.
Others can post more info on this. I'll try to send some of Sam's
links to iodine info.
Sue

Girls,
About 25 years ago, I was having dizzy spells, and found out at the health food store that, being on thyroid, we need to take an occasional potassium supplememt. And, do you know to never take calcium with iron? The iron will absorb and sluff off the calcium, so just take at different times. Most multivitamins have both, and this is a waste. I've also gotten some mobility back taking 1 tsp of MSM daily, dissolved in water with Vitamin C. It's really helped. And--except for a few years, I've been on Armour's over 50 years! I had my thyroid zapped with radiation to remove a tumor then. I can't handle synthyroid at all!
Charlotte

What is organic iodine? I am familiar with iodine but not organic. Also, is there a particular test that one can do to see if one is iodine deficient? My new doctor suggested this. I think it is quite costly, so am wondering. I did a pseudo test, something I found on the internet where you apply a two inch circle to a soft area(I did upper inner arm) and if it disappears within an hour, you are deficient. Mine did not disappear within an hour. Would love more info from anyone about this. I see my doctor on Tuesday and must decide whether to take this test or not. I am under the impression it will not be covered by insurance.

Thank you,
Mari

I too am on Armour after struggling with various thyroid replacents
for almost 4 years, it was so difficult even while having lab reports
completed monthly. I felt unusual tingling throughout my body,
swelling, aches and pains, trouble sleeping, poor digestion, etc,
these are just a few symptoms I had on various thyroid replacements.
When I slowly added Armour some symptoms were starting to disapear,
it was too good to be true, or so I thought. I decided to take a
different path that I thought very few had chosen, full Armour. I had
no one to talk to or compare my results with until I created my own
support group. It was not an easy transition but I waited with the
utmost patience while my body began to heal itself, which was pretty
amazing because I never knew my body needed to heal from being on
Synthroid. I was told this was an appropriate thyroid replacement for
me but it turmned out not be. You see I not only had a total
thyroidectomy but I also suffered the loss of all 4 of my parathyroid
glands as well. hich means my body does not produce calcium at all. I
suffered symptoms of tutany excessively. It was a complete night mare
for 4 years. I tried to explain to various Drs what I had been
feeling and I was instructed to take up to 10,000mg of calcium a day
divided into 3 parts through out the day. Within the second year I
devoloped kidney stones, I didn't want to go through another surgury
so I did some homeopthy cleanses and changed my Oscal calcium to
Calcium citrate and dropped to 6000 mg, the following 8 months kidney
stones returned by this time I was on Armour full strength and
amazingly all I needed to take was 2000mg in morning and 2000mg at
bedtime....I learned that Armour contained CALCITONIN which may have
been what I was needing all along. At any rate there are about 7
other very important ingredients that were needed to regulate my body
because I had no thyroid at all. Armour may not be good for all as
with all thyroid replacements it's individually based and it took
almost 4 years to find mine, who knows what the future will hold for
me I may need to add a t4, but for now nopw Armour is what worked
completely....

Hi Karen,
lol! You sure got the ball rolling, that's for sure!
I think the HOLY COW post (among others) is just gonna keep on
getting bigger. But that's a good thing! I'm hoping that we can help
a certain someone out in getting her health issues figured out. :0)
Are you being treated for being hypo? I am going to ask my dr about
testing my iodine levels to see if I am deficient. I am betting that
you are, too. I want to get the book about being iodine deficient by
Dr Brownstein. He also has a book about salt and how your body needs
it.
I hope you'll post often so we can help you on your health issues. I
think you'll be glad that you hang out here. Trust me. <Wink ~ wink
lol
Sue

Well I probably won't say HOLY COW again!!! LOL!!! :-&

Thanks so much for the moving on post!!! Ignore is a good feature in chat, wish they had it on the boards!!!

When I'm not deathly sick like I am right now, or depressed like I am right now or the LONG laundry list of very hypo symptoms.... I love to just walk. Outdoors, indoors it doesn't matter. Before I developed Graves disease I was walking up to 4 miles per day, 5-6 days a week. I love the walking tapes by Leslie Sansone. Walk Away the Pounds did just that for me, when I wasn't battling the thyroid issue anyway.

Thanks for the UPLIFTING POST!!!

{{{HUGZ}}}
GOD BLESS

Make It A Great Day!!

Karen

You know how many nights I slept about two hrs or less? I was so busy
listening to my hubby stop breating in his sleep. Make sure that you
use it for now!
Sue

Nothing yet but yoga is something I would like to give a try. I have heard good things about it. I know I need to try something but I'm not up to exercise classes yet.

Vicki

Hi Amy,
We have two rooms in our house that have been turned into a home gym.
We should just knock out a wall and combine the two rooms into one
big room.
My husband just bought me the Iron Yoga dvd by Anthony Carillo. I
have used it a few times and really like it. It would probably be a
good one for you, too.
Sue

I've read that the surgery is not very successful in many cases and
it's a treatment of last option. Most doctors seem to think the
cpap is the treatment of choice. I never really worry about dying
in my sleep, but I guess it could happen. I am guilty of falling
asleep before putting my mask on. Bad, bad Amy.
I wish my sleep apnea would have gone away with Armour, but I think
it's going to take some weight removal for this to happen.
Amy

Okay, let's talk about something that actually might be
helpful..........
This group is called Thyroid Fitness. Besides thyroid or other
medications, what is something that you do for yourself that helps
you deal with your hypo and makes you feel good?
Like I mentioned last night, I'm exploring yoga. I used to think it
was wimpy and boring, but after doing it, I find I'm wrong. I'm
only doing very short workouts. I have these great ones called Sara
Ivanhoe's 20 minute yoga makeovers. There are 5 of them. 20
minutes is a good time for me, because I don't get too bored and I
can squeeze them in here and there. And Sara is a great instructor.
I find the deep stretching and breathing to be extremely relaxing.
I feel so good after I finish one of these workouts. Doing yoga
makes me want to get better at it and pefect the difficult poses.
If I go a few days without yoga, I find my body craving it.
So, what does everyone else do for themselves?
Amy

Hallo Monique,
Mag ik vragen wie je tegenpartij is. We hebben namelijk allemaal zo onze
ervaringen met deze ............ en kunnen elkaar vaak van advies dienen.
Groet
Anne

Marie, been there, done that, no problems. It does work better to take them at night and your ankles won't swell, same for hormones with change of life, which could be what you're starting. Don't worry, it's all normal. They have to do that as a precaution so the pill will be safer.
Remember, no two women are alike, so if the bc pills cause side effects, ask for them to be changed. Feel free to ask more.
Good luck, and my
God Bless,
Charlotte

ANP vrijdag 12 maart 2004, geselecteerd en bewerkt voor Whiplash
Internetwerken www.start.at/whiplash
DEN HAAG - Vakbonden en werkgeversorganisaties hebben de versoepeling van de
WAO-plannen positief ontvangen. Het kabinet besloot vrijdag de keuringseisen
voor een WAO-uitkering te verzachten. Ook worden bestaande WAO'ers ontzien
in vergelijking met de oorspronkelijke plannen. De sociale partners hadden
geëist dat het kabinet zijn oorspronkelijke voornemens zou aanpassen.
Kern van het nieuwe WAO-stelsel blijft dat vanaf 2006 alleen volledig
arbeidsongeschikten nog een WAO-uitkering krijgen. De rest moet aan de slag
blijven met een aanvulling op het loon. De werkgever moet die betalen. Hij
kan het risico onderbrengen bij uitkeringsinstaie UWV of het particulier
verzekeren.
De keurinsgseisen worden in 2006 strenger, maar minder streng dan eerst de
bedoeling was. Het kabinet houdt ook vast aan de herbeoordeling van
bestaande WAO'ers vanaf 1 juli van dit jaar. Daarbij wordt gewerkt met de
nieuwe, strengere regels. Bestaande WAO'ers blijven echter onder het oude
WAO-regime vallen, waardoor ze ook nog een WAO-uitkering kunnen krijgen als
ze niet volledig arbeidsongeschikt zijn. Bovendien worden bestaande WAO'ers
boven de 55 jaar niet herkeurd.
Het kabinet volgt met deze aanpassingen op hoofdlijnen een advies van de
Sociaal-Economsiche Raad (SER), zoals werkgevers en werknemers hadden
geëist. De sociale partners tonen zich dan ook tevreden, al hebben ze nog
steeds kritiek.
De vakcentale FNV noemt de nieuwe plannen 'absoluut een vooruitgang'.
FNV-voorzitter De Waal blijft echter moeite houden met de herbeoordeling van
bestaande WAO'ers aan de hand van strengere keuringseisen. Volgens hem heeft
deze groep weinig kans om nog aan de slag te komen.
CNV-voorzitter Terpstra zegt 'voorzichtig positief gestemd' te zijn over het
kabinetsplan. Hij juicht de versoepeling van de keuringsnormen toe. Ook
Terpstra is kritisch over de voorgenomen herkeuring van bestaande WAO'ers.
Ook de werkgevers zijn te spreken over de versoepelingen die het kabinet
heeft doorgevoerd. Volgens MKB-Nederland doet het kabinet op hoofdlijnen wat
de sociale partners hadden gevraagd. VNO-NCW is positief, maar heeft nog
vragen over de gedeeltelijke privatisering van de uitvoering van de WAO.
Bij de regeringspartijen in de Tweede Kamer overheerst de tevredenheid. Het
CDA spreekt van een 'helder voorstel, waarin goed en zorgvuldig het advies
van de SER is meegwogen'. Vice-fractievoorzitter Verburg is blij dat het
huidige WAO-regime van kracht blijft voor bestaande WAO'ers.
Ook D66-Tweede-kamerlid Bakker steunt de voorstellen. Volgens hem heeft het
kabinet gekozen voor een redelijke balans tussen wat nodig is om het aantal
WAO'ers terug te dringen en wat sociaal verantwoord is.
De VVD is het meest kritisch van de regeringsfracties.
Vice-fractievoozritetr De Vries vreest dat bestaande WAO'ers onvoldoende
worden geprikkeld om aan de slag te gaan.
De oppositiepartijen hebben weinig lof over de kabinetsplannen. De PvdA
constateert wel dat het kabinet zijn eerdere 'desastreuze' voorstellen deels
heeft teruggedraaid, maar houdt grote bezwaren tegen het voornemen bestaande
gevallen opnieuw te beoordelen met strengere normen. GroenLinks heeft
dezelfde kritiek. De SP spreekt van 'een nekslag voor een sociale WAO en
roept op tot actie'.

Hallo Moniek,
Ben het helemaal met je eens,het is maar makkelijk om te zeggen ga maar
naar een psycholoog.
Zelf ben ik er ook geweest en mij heeft het wel geholpen. Maar daarna
kreeg ik veel problemen met mijn echtgenoot die zou ook wel een goede
psycholoog kunnen gebruiken. Nee het ligt alleen aan de Whippie's. En voor
hun dan er is toch ook veel veranderd? Ze moeten zich aanpassen, er leren
omgaan dat ze een zieke echtgenoot of echtgenote hebben. Hun leven staat
toch ook op zijn kop.
groetjes
Gerda

Hi Amy
Looks like your lab had a different range with the T4. Actually I
haven't been doing yoga lately, but just now starting to exercise
again. I wish yoga fixed my thyroid -- lots of luck.
It's RIDICULOUS trying to get a doctor to treat your thyroid instead
of pituitary! I'm going to be self-medicating -- I have given up on
doctors. The stupid doc I saw today would rather keep me on a dose
where I was having trouble breathing (2 grains) than a dose I actually
feel well on --3-1/2 grains. My thyroid hormones were actually in the
normal range for a change, just on the low side. But ALL she could
focus on was my TSH --0.027, then when I said I was taking the 3-1/2
so I could breathe and not experience severe hypo symptoms at 2
grains, she didn't want to treat me anymore and suggested I go to an
endocrinologist. She would rather be "right" and prescribe a dose
where I had trouble BREATHING, than be wrong and prescribe a
health-giving dose. I think what a LOT of these doctors are doing is
just plain WRONG! It's a SIN for them to treat us hypo patients this
way! I think we need to be judging the DOCTORS! If they had their
act together, we wouldn't be forced to consider self-medicating to
feel well.
These doctors seem more specialized in treating pituitary hormones
than thyroid! I really don't have the money to keep doctor shopping.
I'm sick of these stupid doctors.
Melinda

I'm hearing the same thing about drs over and over. On the Stop The
Thyroid Madness site, they have a list of stupid things dr have said.
Some of them are hilarious!
lol
Sue

Hey, Yogalindy! I think I've seen you on some other thyroid
groups. I'm just delving into yoga for the first time ever. I used
to think it was boring, but I'm really starting to get into it.
Are you a yoga expert? How has yoga helped your thyroid issues? If
at all?
Thanks for the info,
Amy

Hi I am Kelli,
I suffer from thyroid tumors. Looking forward to getting into shape
with you guys. Any advice for the newbie? Kelli

Hello - I know this has been discussed but I've never paid much attention to it as my husband had a vasectomy 16 years ago. Over the last 3 months, I've had non-stop cycling and so the doctor has prescribed a very low dose bc pill to stop the bleeding until we can get me in for a biopsy(in the office biopsy was attempted yesterday but not successful, so now I will have to have a surgical biopsy). Also, she knows I have a vacation coming up in October. We may be looking at a hysterectomy. Anyway, I am on Armour and wonder what effects the bc pill will have on my thyroid meds, if any.

Thank you,
Marie

Kabinet volgt SER-advies over nieuw WAO-stelsel op hoofdlijnen
12 maart 2004 bron: min szw; geselecteerd en bewerkt voor Whiplash
Internetwerken www.start.at/whiplash
Het kabinet neemt in hoofdlijnen het advies over van de Sociaal-Economische
Raad (SER) over het nieuwe WAO-stelsel. Bij de keuring voor een uitkering
voor volledige en duurzame arbeidsongeschiktheid (de IVA) wordt gekeken naar
het werk dat iemand nog kan doen en wat hij daarmee kan verdienen.
Arbeidsongeschikten die minder dan 80 procent loonverlies lijden of van wie
herstel binnen vijf jaar is te verwachten, vallen onder de regeling
Werkhervatting Gedeeltelijk Arbeidsgeschikten. Het kabinet laat werkgevers
de keuze of ze het risico van gedeeltelijke arbeidsgeschiktheid zelf dragen,
onderbrengen bij een private verzekeraar of bij het Uitvoeringsinstituut
Werknemersverzekeringen (UWV). De huidige WAO blijft gelden voor bestaande
gevallen. Wel zal op 1 juli 2004 een aangescherpt Schattingsbesluit - dat
betrekking heeft op het arbeidskundige deel van de beoordeling - in werking
treden.
Dit staat in het kabinetsstandpunt over het SER-advies dat minister De Geus
van Sociale Zaken en Werkgelegenheid naar de Tweede Kamer heeft gestuurd
Kern van het nieuwe stelsel is dat gedeeltelijk arbeidsgeschikten zoveel
mogelijk aan het werk blijven. Alleen mensen die geen enkele mogelijkheid
hebben om (op termijn) weer aan het werk te gaan, krijgen een uitkering op
grond van de nieuwe regeling voor volledige en duurzame
arbeidsongeschiktheid. Werkenden die gedeeltelijk arbeidsgeschikt zijn,
krijgen een aanvullende uitkering die het loonverlies grotendeels
compenseert. Niet-werkenden krijgen een uitkering vergelijkbaar met de WW.
Als deze uitkering afloopt, is er - zo is bij het Najaarsakkoord
afgesproken - een individuele uitkering, gebaseerd op het minimumloon en
afhankelijk van de mate van arbeidsongeschiktheid. Dit betekent dat het
altijd financieel lonend is om (meer) te werken. Werknemers die minder dan
35 procent loonverlies lijden vallen niet onder de regeling voor
gedeeltelijk arbeidsgeschikten, maar blijven in dienst van de werkgever.
Het kabinet neemt de voorstellen van de SER wat betreft de keuring
grotendeels over. Voor het medische deel van de keuring komen er lijsten
waarop een indicatie wordt gegeven van de gebruikelijke hersteltermijnen van
ziektes. Artsen kunnen alleen gemotiveerd en via een bepaalde procedure
afwijken van de indicatie op deze lijst. Het kabinet volgt niet het voorstel
van de SER om mensen die na twee jaar ziekte een 'geringe' kans hebben om te
herstellen, toe te laten tot de nieuwe regeling voor volledig en duurzaam
arbeidsongeschikten. Werknemers mogen niet onnodig vroeg worden
'afgeschreven'. Bovendien acht het kabinet het risico te groot dat hierdoor
bij hantering van het criterium van de SER jaarlijks toch meer dan 25.000
mensen in de regeling voor volledig en duurzaam arbeidsongeschikten komen.
Als later blijkt dat iemand inderdaad niet herstelt, dan krijgt hij alsnog
een uitkering voor volledige en duurzame arbeidsongeschiktheid.
Het voorstel van de SER om in bepaalde gevallen al eerder dan na twee jaar
ziekte een keuring toe te staan, neemt het kabinet over. Het gaat dan alleen
om mensen die niet meer kunnen werken en waarbij het volledig duidelijk is
dat enige kans op herstel niet aan de orde is.
Het kabinet geeft werkgevers de keuzevrijheid het risico op gedeeltelijke
arbeidsgeschiktheid van werknemers zelf te dragen, onder te brengen bij een
private verzekeraar of bij het UWV te blijven. Het UWV blijft in alle
gevallen de keuring verrichten. Het kabinet acht de financiële consequenties
van een volledig private uitvoering van de regeling voor werkgevers,
werknemers en overheid te hoog, zeker gezien de sociaal-economische situatie
waarin Nederland momenteel verkeert. Uit offertes van private verzekeraars
en het UWV blijkt dat private uitvoering in de eerste jaren veel duurder is
dan publieke uitvoering. Over de periode 2006-2010 bedragen de extra kosten
naar schatting 4 tot 6 miljard euro. Ook daarna is het kostenniveau een
onzekere factor.
Werkgevers die bij het UWV blijven, gaan een premie betalen waarvan de
hoogte afhangt van het aantal gedeeltelijk arbeidsgeschikte werknemers in
het bedrijf. Ondernemingen met relatief minder gedeeltelijk
arbeidsgeschikten betalen een lagere premie. Hiermee wordt voorkomen dat
vooral bedrijven met een hoog risico op arbeidsongeschikten bij het UWV
blijven.
Het kabinet is het met de SER eens dat het nieuwe stelsel alleen van
toepassing moet zijn op 'nieuwe gevallen'. Mensen die nu al een
WAO-uitkering hebben, komen niet in het nieuwe stelsel. Wel kunnen zij vanaf
1 juli 2004 te maken krijgen met een herbeoordeling, waarbij de nieuwe,
strengere eisen gelden. Het kabinet maakt hierbij een uitzondering voor
mensen die op 1 juli 2004 55 jaar of ouder zijn of die bij eerdere
herkeuringsoperaties zijn ontzien.
Het arbeidskundige deel van de beoordeling, waarbij wordt gekeken wat voor
werk iemand gezien zijn beperkingen nog kan verrichten, wordt per 1 juli
2004 aangescherpt. Onderdeel daarvan is dat de arbeidskundige drie functies
moet aangeven die de betrokkene nog kan vervullen. Van iedere functie moeten
minstens drie bestaande banen in het computersysteem van de arbeidskundige
zijn opgenomen. Dit is een versoepeling ten opzichte van het eerdere
kabinetsvoorstel, waarbij werd uitgegaan van één bestaande baan per functie.
De SER heeft voorgesteld om voor de uitzendsector de kosten te beperken
omdat uitzendbedrijven vaak weinig invloed kunnen uitoefenen op het
arbeidsongeschikt worden van medewerkers die zij uitzenden. Het kabinet komt
hier in belangrijke mate aan tegemoet door een plafond te stellen aan de
lasten van het doorbetalen van loon tijdens de eerste twee ziektejaren.
Het kabinet streeft ernaar het nieuwe stelsel in te laten gaan per 1 januari
2006. Sinds 1 januari 2004 moeten werkgevers al twee jaar het loon van zieke
werknemers doorbetalen. In het tweede ziektejaar is dit beperkt tot 70
procent van het loon. Doel van het kabinet is om de instroom in de nieuwe
regeling voor volledig en duurzaam arbeidsongeschikten blijvend te beperken
tot maximaal 25.000 per jaar. Als dat wordt bereikt en als de
loondoorbetaling in het tweede ziektejaar beperkt blijft tot 70 procent, zal
de uitkering van volledig arbeidsongeschikten met 5 procentpunt worden
verhoogd. Ook wordt dan voor de regeling voor volledig en duurzaam
arbeidsongeschikten de Wet Premiedifferentiatie en marktwerking bij
arbeidsongeschiktheidsregelingen afgeschaft, die regelt dat werkgevers met
veel arbeidsongeschikten meer premie betalen dan werkgevers met minder of
geen arbeidsongeschikten.
Het kabinet zal tijdig voor de invoering van het nieuwe stelsel een afweging
maken over de verdragsrechtelijke noodzaak van een regeling voor
beroepsrisico's. Een dergelijke regeling zou de inkomens- en andere schade
dekken van arbeidsongeschiktheid als gevolg van een beroepsziekte of
arbeidsongeval.
Met het nieuwe stelsel zijn besparingen gemoeid die op termijn oplopen tot 2
miljard euro per jaar. Momenteel kost de WAO circa 12 miljard euro per jaar.
Als gevolg van de stelselwijziging daalt het aantal mensen met een
arbeidsongeschiktheidsuitkering op termijn met 25 procent.

Hi Amy

Thanks so much for the lengthy reply! I have a hyper thyroid according to the tests. I had them all, the exray, the photographs, the video of my thyroid working, they gave me a shot of radiation ink (stuff?),.. one test showed Graves, the other test showed nodular goiter.

Why can't I wrap my head around what all of this means??? How is Graves/NGoiter treated? I take medication Neo - Mercazole 30mg per day, for 5 weeks.. which brought my T4 and T4 down slightly. From T4 18.1 to 16.2 and T3 from 6.6 to 5.4.

TSH is still the same 0.01 it's been that way for over a year now.

I imagine I'm not asking the right questions (to my endo),.. they say they have to work on getting the TSH up.. okay, so what does a low TSH level mean your body is doing.. what are the dangers of having low TSH, why not leave it alone? Mind you, I would feel even more hyper. And get this, I have gained weight not lost. My appetite is out of control.

Thank you for your opinion Amy.

x
I'm so sorry you're having these troubles, and I absolutely hear your frustration. It sounds like your doctor isn't instilling much confidence in your, which I understand. I never could find a doctor I felt like really listened to me and wanted to work with me based on my symptoms.
What type of medication are you taking? You say you have Graves, which makes me think at one point you were hyperthyroid. Did you have any RAI to kill it off? Do you have any lab reports you could post with the lab ranges that we could look at?
The racing heart could by hyper, or it could be adrenal symptoms. The memory problems can definitely be a hypo symptom, but I've heard this also comes with hyper. I wonder if you have Hashi's, an autoimmune thyroid disease which can make you swing between hypo and hyper as the antibodies do their work of killing off the thyroid, but it sounds like you've already been given a Graves diagnosis.
I hesitate to say more at the risk of being yelled at for giving bad advice. I don't tow the standard party line of TSH as GOD that has been shoved down our throats by Abbott Pharmaceutical, the makers of not only Synthroid, but also the TSH test, and the major funding source for thyroid research. No bias there, right?
Good luck!
Amy

Hi again. Do you mind posting the ranges again? I have a hard time telling
anything without the ranges to go by.
Amy

Certainly.

T4 is 16.2 (range 9.0-19.0)

T3 is 5.4 (range is 2.6-6.0)

TSH is .01 (range is .30-5.00)

Thank you!
Hi again. Do you mind posting the ranges again? I have a hard time telling anything without the ranges to go by.
Amy

thanks amy I will check that web page out!

antoinette, mommy too---
Nicholas Derrell 8 yrs.11m.
Nathan stewart 4 yrs. 7m.
briana Rose 2 yrs. 1m.

Hi Vicki,
Have you tested your adrenals to see where your cortisol levels fall?
When I started off on a low dose of cortef, (20 mgs) I only took 5
mgs for the first week. We added in another 5 mgs the second week and
did that for four weeks. I have been taking cortef for a year and now
I'm off of it and doing fine with 3 grains of armour. If you go to
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com, maybe someone there can recommend a dr
that knows how to treat by symptoms and not the TSH. My dr said he is
one who doesn't flinch when he sees a low tsh....especially when
you're taking armour. Ya gotta love my dr!
I don't think that most drs know how to treat hypothyroidism and my
dr says that most want to burn your thyroid off if you are
hyperthyroid and don't tell you that afterwards, you will become
hypo! Amazing but true!!
Sue

I was diagnosed hypo 6+ years ago. I kept telling the doctors that I
was still having hypo symptoms. They changed the synthroid dosages so
many times it isn't funny. Finally they got tired of hearing me
complain so the one doctor put me on effexor. That did nothing and was
torture to get off. My doctor here tried synthetic T4/T3 combos and
that didn't help either. I started on armour in April after standing
in the grocery store in tears begging for a prescription. I am feeling
75% better. I'm trying to find the right medication for adrenal
fatigue so I can raise my Armour dose and get to 100%. And of course
I'm fighting my doctor all the way. She admits she knows nothing about
dosing Armour but won't listen to me when I tell her I want to dose to
symptoms and not her stupid TSH test. I have so much weight to lose,
it stinks. Look forward to reading others stories. Only by reading
about what others have gone through was I able to find out what
medication was right for me.
Vicki

My hubby used to keep his thyroid meds in his truck. He doesn't
anymore since his dr told him about that.
Sue

Hi,
My name is Sue. I think I first thought that I was hypo back in 1993.
My dr tested my thyroid with the TSH test. He said it was normal and
to go home and eat less and to work out each day for an hr at a time.
I knew that it wasn't my diet, I eat really healthy (good protein,
good fats and good carbs) and I was working out but no matter what I
did, I was very tired, achey and getting a bit down over not feeling
like I normally did. He offered me anti depressants but I wasn't
depressed and I knew that taking them would be like putting a band
aid on the problem. I also never returned to that dr because I didn't
think he wanted to get me well. He also insulted me by offering the
anti depressants to me. The following drs also tested my thyroid and
it came back normal.
I finally went to another dr in 2000 and he ran my TSH but he was the
ONLY dr who said we also had to run the Free T3 & Free T4 levels. He
said the TSH is ok for your first time thyroid testing but after
that, it's your Frees that matter most. He said that my TSH was high
and that my Frees were the lowest that he had seen in a long time. I
couldn't believe what I was hearing.
I also found out thru my dr that they changed the TSH levels to the
newer ranges which are 0.3 - 3.0 and he said that so many people are
getting the wrong diagnosis because most drs aren't using the newer
ranges and most drs don't test your Free T3 & Free T4 levels. That's
so wrong to keep someone ill but my dr said that it keeps the patient
returning because untreated hypo can make the pharmaceutical
companies big bucks with drs prescribing cholesterol lowering meds,
fosamax, diabetes meds, sleep meds, anti depressant meds, etc.
He started me off on 15 mgs of Armour thyroid and I did ok on it
until I got to 2 1/2 grains. I then I started to have problems. I
looked at the Armour insert and guess what? It said that you MUST
test your adrenals prior to taking thyroid medication because thyroid
meds will stress out your adrenals if they are low in cortisol!!! I
wasn't very happy with my dr but he ordered the 4x per day saliva
test and my levels were low on three out of the four times. My dr
said that if your cortisol levels are low and you take thyroid meds
that it will just build up in your blood cells and that you will
experience hyper feelings.
My dr lowered my dose and started me off on low dose cortef. I
started off taking 5 mgs for a week and then raising it by another 5
mgs until I got to 20 mgs. (5 mgs 4x per day) I was able to raise my
armour dose without any problems at all. I felt awesome! I am now off
of the cortef and doing great on 3 grains of armour.
I am hoping that I can start working out again because I really feel
great on the armour. My Mom was taking Synthroid but she had high
cholesterol and and developed heart problems and died from a heart
attack. I recently got both of my sisters off of synthroid and they
are both amazed at how much the armour has helped them to gain back
what they thought was lost. I wish that I had known about my dr back
when my Mom was so ill. I think he could have saved her. Such a
waste.
I look forward to meeting everyone and finding out what exercise
programs have worked for them!
Sue

I just signed up so I missed the polls for getting a copy of my lab
results. I never used to ask about my lab results because my dr
always said they were always in the normal range. Since finding out
that I was hypo, I always ask for them to mail me a copy of my lab
results. When I took our dog in for lab work, I asked for a copy of
his, too. The look on their faces was priceless. lol
I think everyone should get a copy of all of their lab work. It's a
good way to see if anything has gotten better or worse and also to
see if your dr is doing his job to keep you healthy.
Sue

Hi Karen,
I'm glad we have the internet so we can share our experiences, good or
bad with others who are in the same situations. I think we scare the
medical community because we do know what we are talking about.
I'm so sorry that your dr did the total thyroidectomy on you. That
isn't necessary. I hope others will learn from your experience and ask

Antoinette, I've had the same problem, and it turned out to be low ferritin.
That can cause heart palps. The normal range says it should be 10-200, but I've
read things that say it needs to be 70-90 to utilize thyroid hormones correctly.
Mine was 30, so I've been taking iron supplements to get it up.
There's a lot of great info about ferritin and other thyroid related stuff at
www.stopthethyroidmadness.com
Amy

I'm so sorry you're having these troubles, and I absolutely hear your
frustration. It sounds like your doctor isn't instilling much confidence in
your, which I understand. I never could find a doctor I felt like really
listened to me and wanted to work with me based on my symptoms.
What type of medication are you taking? You say you have Graves, which makes me
think at one point you were hyperthyroid. Did you have any RAI to kill it off?
Do you have any lab reports you could post with the lab ranges that we could
look at?
The racing heart could by hyper, or it could be adrenal symptoms. The memory
problems can definitely be a hypo symptom, but I've heard this also comes with
hyper. I wonder if you have Hashi's, an autoimmune thyroid disease which can
make you swing between hypo and hyper as the antibodies do their work of killing
off the thyroid, but it sounds like you've already been given a Graves
diagnosis.
I hesitate to say more at the risk of being yelled at for giving bad advice. I
don't tow the standard party line of TSH as GOD that has been shoved down our
throats by Abbott Pharmaceutical, the makers of not only Synthroid, but also the
TSH test, and the major funding source for thyroid research. No bias there,
right?
Good luck!
Amy

current dose, I wouldn't even consider lowering your medications. I
hate it when doctor's want to strictly dose by TSH instead of by how
a person feels. Are you having any symptoms of hyperthyroidism?<<

-- Amy, This is true, strictly diagnosing via TSH alone is not good. You asked a good question about SYMPTOMS of hyperT. However, losing weight is not always good...even if you "need" to lose weight.
adrenal glands don't put out enough cortisol. From what I've
learned, low cortisol and hypo very frequently go hand in hand. <<

-- Amy, This is incorrect. Cushing's is when the body produces HUGE amounts of Cortisol. Addison's is the low/no cortisol production. Low/inconsistent cortisol or Addison's is often a precurser to hypO. It is also called adrenal burnout, adrenal fatigue, hypoadrenia, stressed adrenals and I am sure many more. There doesn't seem to be any *one* name for that, at least at this time.
thyroid hormones just float around in your bloodstream and cannot get
into the cells where they do their work on metabolism. The body
needs sufficient cortisol to get thyroid hormones into the cells.<<

-- This is basically correct. There are also other factors that can be present, or not even the cortisol, but something else, such as low Ferritin.
bloodstream, that might account for your high FT4. I wonder what
your FT3 level is and if your body can effectively convert T4 into
T3, which is the active form that the body uses for energy.<<

-- Again, this is correct. Many times tests don't reveal what is truly going on. However, even if these tests are a good way to determine how the body is using the replacement, they *do* still fluctuate...and symptoms also need to be looked at in conjunction with numbers.
a dose where you feel good. Unless you are having hyper symptoms.<<

-- Generally speaking, this is decent advice.

-- Generally agreed. Endo's *can* be good. Although most don't *listen* to the patient. They look at the numbers. VERY good thyroid care can be gotten via a PCP...usually DO's or someone more alternative.

-- Now, that concerns me. One should ALWAYS get information from LOTS of different places/sources and such. Don't most of us complain that doctor's only listen to what the pharmaceutical companies are telling them?! Don't put all your eggs in one basket so to speak...or don't get all your education from one source, as there is *always* a bias.

-- That all depends on the group! NTH is Armour promoting. Others are not. And still others are both.

-- I also take Armour. I took synthroid/equivalent for 13+ years. Did n't get better, not really. HOWEVER, like mentioned previously...my adrenals were shot. I was malnourished, due to leaky gut created by Celiac. I had low Ferritin and numerous OTHER issues going on. They sort of all work together, or don't work together, if that makes sense.

I have also found that Armour works best for ME. That is not the case for everyone. I agree though, I was undertreated for a very long time...not really *under* but inadequately, due to my doctor(s) lack of foresight to investigate related issues. I was just told it was in my head. That I was fine, other than being somewhat of a hypochondriac. I was told it was genetic and to get used to it...deal with the cards you have been dealt.

WELL, that is ultimately what caused me to move on to a new doc...and I finally got the help I needed.

Sherry, I hope this makes sense to you. Feel free to write to me personally, if you want to. I have Hashimoto's, so my situation is different than yours.

Have a great day,

Laura

Laura, thank you for correcting me on my adrenal disorders. Looks like I had
Cushing and Addison's mixed up. I really thought Cushings was the one where you
were low, but now that I think again, I realize this is wrong. Sorry.
I also have low Ferritin, but I have a hard time remembering to take as much
iron as I need to get it up where it needs to be.
I know it's not always good to lose weight, and loosing too fast is a problem.
I think the basic jist of my post is the labs don't always tell the story, and
to listen to your body. Remember all the times we were told there was nothing
wrong with us? That it was all in our heads, or we were just depressed? We
KNEW something was wrong, even if people thought we were nuts.
I've researched other places besides NTH and Stop the Thyroid Madness. Those
are just my two favs, so they are the ones I mentioned. I'm glad you had such a
good experience with Armour. I'm still working on finding the medicine combo
that works just right for me.
Amy

Thank you so much, Karen. This is pretty much exactly what I was trying to say,
only you did it much more eloquently. I was a tad emotional. Thanks for
expressing this.
Amy